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    Content, Copywriting, and the future of Online Learning with Peep Laja of ConversionXL

    Peep Laja is the founder and CEO of CXL, or ConversionXL, which is a top name in the marketing world. In 2011 he started blogging specifically about CRO “Conversion Rate Optimization” and quickly grew to the most respected name in the game. He also runs a software company CopyTesting.com. He lives in Austin most of the year, and Estonia the rest of the year.


    Listen to the audio interview here:


    We’ve also chopped up this interview into little clips:

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    Changing domain names and brand name. "Did you see any effect at all?"

    • You changed name from ConversionXL.com to CXL.com...why, and what did you learn?
    • I did a little spying, it took you about a year to get back to your organic traffic levels. Is this true?
    • June 2019 you were quoted as saying “CXL.com is owned by a Chinese company who wants too much money.” Now you own CXL.com. How much did CXL cost?
    • Overall do you think changing the name changed anything?
    • Does it change morale? Your own view of it? Do customers care?
    • "If you're buying from a Chinese company, make sure to use a Chinese broker."
    • "We paid $47,000 for a 3-letter domain."
    • How long till your organic rankings came back to the new domain?
    • "We strategically switched the name in December."



    What do you think of online learning and how is it changing? "Course completion rates are low, but does it matter?"

    • Starting a thing called "Adeft."
    • Crowdfunding Adeft to start.
    • Course completion rates are low, but does it matter?
    • I admire how you turned courses into an “institute.” Smart move. Why do you call it an institute, and does that give it more cache.
    • Started with in person learning, then through books, then on tape, then through pdf and articles, then on video, then through software, then through community ….now what?
    • Where do you think the industry is going?
    • "We found people take courses when they are assigned a task."


    Why did you create Copytesting.com, and what are the most common mistakes you see?

    • I published a post about using Copytesting.com on our own sales page.
    • You have an awesome service called copytesting.com. I’ve used it, and got others onto it too.
    • Why did you start that?
    • I’m assuming you can see some of the tests, what have you learned?
    • What is the most common thing wrong with pages?
    • "Fastest growing demographic using it are B2b SaaS companies."
    • "People use a lot of buzzwords that mean nothing."


    UX Design, avoiding "chasing analytics" and understand "The Hippo."

    • How much time do ya’ll spend on UX design. Meaning the overall look and feel of site.
    • You see hundreds of tests, is design important?
    • What about someone like me, who knows good design when I see it, but can’t MAKE IT myself?
    • You’re a super analytical person, do you just go off numbers or intuition? Apple story.
    • “Chasing Analytics.” Do people often go wrong just chasing the data. YouTube example BeardBrand.
    • "It's super effective up to a point, then diminishing returns."
    • "The Hippo" is the "Higher Paid Person's Opinion 😂"


    Content Marketing, SEO, and avoiding the "Sea Of Sameness."

    • How much of your business comes from people consuming your content first.
    • Have you ever seen a company really crush content marketing, where the founder was NOT good at it? AppSumo, TheHustle, HubSpot etc….they crush content marketing, but the founders were all great at it.
    • “The Sea of Sameness” - So you did original UX research studies. You did crazy studies most people can’t (or won’t) do.
    • We lost a lot of SEO, but revenue wasn’t really impacted. We did lose email signups.
    • Have ya’ll started focusing more on social or YouTube than content? Thoughts?
    • "There's an interesting site called Growth.design that's just so different from other content."
    • "Social media is more about an individual rather than a company."


    "Does running an agency ssuuccckk?":

    • You are interesting in that you have all sorts of irons in the fire. Saas, Agency, Conferences, Institute. Can you explain all the different prongs of business CXL is in?
    • Does running an agency suck?
    • What exactly does the agency side do?
    • The whole Estonia thing. Why are they good?
    • "You get great people, who speak perfect English, for a better price."


    Happiness, living in two countries, and disconnecting:

    • How do you think of happiness?
    • You leave the US and stay in Estonia for months at a time. What do you get out of that?
    • When you are so absent from the biz, do you feel left behind or out of the loop?
    • How does an analytical Estonian as yourself view life. Any purpose or just live?
    • What's the purpose of life? "I'm a big traditions guy. I like having tasks. I like finding meaning in any work."
    • "You need to be happy. You need to do things that give you joy. And you find meaningful work."


    Follow Peep Laja:

    🖥 Website: Conversion XL

    🖥 Website: CopyTesting.com

    🖥 Website: CXL Institute

    🐦 Twitter: @PeepLaja

    Follow Copywriting Course:

    🎦 @Kopywriting

    🎦 Copywriting Course Clips

    🌇 @CopywritingCourse

    🐦 @NevMed

    🖥 Join email list

    Become a member

    This was a really informative conversation with one of the top conversion specialists in the field, I hope you enjoyed and learned as much as I did!


    Neville Medhora - Copywriting Course

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